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Old 08-17-2012, 09:43 AM   #1
Brandon505
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Not sure if this is the right place but. I recently purchased a horse and they said he rode in Tom thumb but whenever I ask him to trot its just him throwing his head around and fighting me the whole time. Could it be the bit or is it me. Not sure if I posted this under the right area but he isn't any of the other areas so I posted here. Thoughts and opinions please I'm at a complete loss.
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Old 08-18-2012, 10:56 AM   #2
horseplay
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Hi Brandon,

I think you may find this article by Mark Rashid regarding the Tom Thumb bit helpful.

http://markrashid.com/docs/tomthumb.pdf


You might want to give a simple quality made eggbutt or ring snaffle a try and work on your horse's understanding.

Good luck!
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Old 08-18-2012, 10:33 PM   #3
Cattleman
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My thoughts on bits:

A bit is a COMMUNICATION device, not a discipline tool. A bit is your telephone to the horse, what you say and how you say it is all up to you. You can get in a shouting match, or you can talk sensibly. You can talk demeaning and degrading or you can talk uplifting and encouraging. You can blame or you can understand. The type of bit you use does not determine your ability to communicate with your horse anymore then a Smart phone allows a person to speak better than an old rotary phone. I have seen people do incredible things in a snaffle, but in order for a horse to progress, a different communication device is needed. These new devices are used to build on the conversation that has already started, you are only refining the conversation. A spade bit is used to have an incredibly intellectual conversation with a horse, very few horses have been to enough schooling or studied enough to understand the conversation. In the same regard very few riders have been to the proper university to understand how to even begin the discussion. I see too many people getting caught up on the fact that a snaffle is direct pressure and curb bits are leverage. BOTH are a form of pressure to the horse, BOTH can ruin a horses mouth if used improperly. I love to study the science of bits, each bit has a different purpose, and each horse can work well in different bits. I would reccomend researching different types of bits and seeing what you are communicating and how you are communicating it, once you learn how to have this make sense to the horse then you can begin having the conversation.

What type of riding do you plan on doing with this horse?
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Old 08-22-2012, 09:23 PM   #4
Brandon505
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Well had a trainer come out and found out its me :/. he suggested that I put him in a martin gale since he is not packing his head correctly. Just was told to ride through it and make him keep going even if he throws his head around. And id like to do cows with him but not sure if hes going to be the best at it.
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Old 08-23-2012, 02:47 PM   #5
Steve C
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Sorry but if the "trainer" told me to just use a martingale and work through it I would be looking for a different trainer, try and find one that is using natural horsemanship, without seeing you and the horse together it is very hard to give accurate advice but there are far better ways then just the old "tie 'em down and make 'em" ways.

Steve
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Old 08-24-2012, 09:12 AM   #6
Brandon505
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The problem is him throwing his head
Here is the problem he had with the Tom thumb
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJ-94...e_gdata_player
But since I have switched to a snaffle bit he has began to respond better I'll try and posh that video later but still he try's to make a fight out of going counter clockwise.
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Old 08-24-2012, 05:26 PM   #7
Cattleman
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A few thoughts after watching the video. That isn't a relaxed horse, he is tossing his head, his ears are pricked, tails in the air. I am not a fan of the Tom Thumb bit, however many people use it just fine. If it were me I would put him in a loose ring snaffle and work on getting to his feet. I remember Ray Hunt once said that if you get the feet in place the rest of the horse falls in line with it. What I took that to mean was that if you are able to get a handle on a horse's feet he would begin to listen to the rider and stop worrying about tossing his head. Sometimes this can be achieved with what I like to call "wet blankets" that just means spending more time in the saddle can help a horse get used to you and your cues as well as helps them relax. Keep us updated on the progress.
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Old 08-24-2012, 09:40 PM   #8
Steve C
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Brandon505,

you haven't stated how many hours this horse has under saddle, from watching the clip the horse just doesn't look settled. I agree with what Cattleman has said. It appears as if your horse isn't happy with the bit and I don't mean the particular bit you are using, I mean in general. How is your horse at flexing, being able to stand still and by picking up a single rein does he willing flex in that direction with out moving his feet, will he back up willing for you. If not this is probably due to holes in his foundation. To me he needs some refining on his foundation and as Cattleman said some "wet saddle blankets". Of what you showed in the clip none of it isn't fixable with patience and persistence. Good luck with him and don't be afraid to ask pointed questions, we all need to ask questions at some point.

regards
Steve
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Old 08-28-2012, 05:20 PM   #9
Brandon505
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Update on him. I have recently switched him into a snaffle and what a world of difference it has made for him and me. We can actual now work together with less fights. He is becoming more patient as well as I am. With the flex thing he will come all the way back to my stirrup on each side. He has improved a large amount since that video I will try and get another one soon. Now its just time riding to get everything back to where it should be.
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Old 11-11-2012, 11:55 PM   #10
Travis Morgan Horseshoein
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He's in pain. He isn't flexing his at all, hardly, and I think his hips hurt too. I honestly can't believe nobody else saw the way he was swaying his ass to get his feet off the ground. Look at him as he moves away. That ain't right. Get him to a vet that specialises in horses.
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