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Old 05-13-2013, 03:44 PM   #1
Maria
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Default Give the face..

Hi everybody..

I need your help.. im trying to get my horse to give me his face whit the bosal/hackamore .. im not sure you say it give the face ..i hope you understand what i mean.. i found a video ..wanted your opinion about it ..if its right ..
thank you all..here i dont have anyone to ask.. i think im the onlyone that use a bosal on the island...




Muchas Gracias

Maria
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Old 05-13-2013, 04:15 PM   #2
Jimmy
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It not right or wrong. It depends what you are trying to accomplish. The horse in the video is quiet and rhythmical. Personally, I don't like the way they are riding that horse in the hackamore. Years ago, I would have thought it just fine. But I have found it detrimental to be having to bump the horse that much, and let his neck drop down that much. They are using the hackamore as if it is a snaffle. Too much emphasis on the horse putting his nose down, when they should, I believe now, let his neck come up. She says he is getting round, but all he is doing is putting his neck down and his chin in. All you need is a little bit of tuck, and certainly no brace, but otherwise let them get their neck out in front of them, and more up. In my opinion.
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:53 PM   #3
Maria
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Muchas Gracias Jimmy !!

I will go after your advice and not "bump" down his face , now when you are saying it ,its a clear difference between getting down the neck like in the video or up and in i see what you mean..

Muchisimas Gracias

Maria
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Old 05-14-2013, 08:42 AM   #4
Baquero
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A great dressage trainer Thomas Ritter once said "Poll flexion is not pull flexion"

I don't personally ride my horses the way they show it in the video. And as has been said, it depends on what you want to accomplish. By bumping your horse's nose in he only becomes harder on the hackamore. I was taught that you are only given so many pulls with a horse, you don't want to waste those pulls trying to bump the horse's face into position. Over bumping creates a dull horse. The other thing I have seen typically happen is you are forcing the horse into a position by bumping them. To reemphasize what Jimmy already mentioned, a lot of riders focus so much on getting the face vertical with the nose in, the headset has a purpose. A horse can work much more balanced if he is rounded in the poll, but the poll is elevated above the withers. When the poll is elevated above the withers, anatomically the horses face rounds back and in. Through time and consistent riding the horse will develop the muscles to carry himself in this way, you cannot force or bump him into a position and have a lasting effect in my experience.
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Old 05-14-2013, 12:04 PM   #5
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Muchas Gracias Baquero!

Now i have some things more clearer ! We will just keep on going then,
we will get there! Could you recommend some DVD for bosal training??

Muchisimas Gracias!

Maria
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:44 AM   #6
MissNVaquero
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I agree that the video is showing too much bumping. I would like to see a whole lot more seat and leg being used.
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Old 05-16-2013, 05:43 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zian Mackay View Post
I think that we need to make sure that we are careful not to judge others, so I am not going to say anything about the rider. When thinking about vaquero horsemanship as a discipline we must remember that if you were a vaquero, you would have to maintain your style of riding all day. I think that this is more of a show pony video because if that was done to a horse all day then unfortunately you would have one sorry horse
Very good point.
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Old 05-17-2013, 09:48 PM   #8
DocsMinnieElixer
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I agree in regards to this particular horse being trained in a way that is geared more toward showing western pleasure or a similar discipline. So it's not wrong and it's not right like already mentioned, it just has a different purpose. They are working that hackamore in a way that is going to produce a very low headed horse, which is what that particular rider is likely striving for. While I want a horse to be soft and give me his face when I ask for it, I dont think that type of training in a hackamore is effective or necessary in a working situation. I find if my horse is getting so high headed or distracted that it's bothering me or I feel I'm losing him, his feet are probably not busy enough and I will usually just ask him to get busy so he has to use himself and the head will usually go where it needs to go. I will ask for his nose for brief periods of time so that he knows how to get soft and frame himself up, but I feel it's counterproductive to hold a horse's face in a bosal without them learning to lean on you. I will ask for his nose a bit more while asking for lateral flexion or two tracking, walking and trotting small circles and then change direction and ask for his nose to that side. It's harder for them to lean on you that way, but again, holding onto them too much in a hackamore in any regard will cause you problems. The problem I see with the typical western pleasure style use of a hackamore like seen in this video is that no forward impulsion or drive is freated from the hindquarters. The horse is not rond or driving up under himself like that seem to believe it is. The nose tucking in does not effect the rest of the body, the drive from your seat and leg is what gets the horse round and reaching under himself, and your hand simply supports and directs that impulsion. That constant bumping and rocking of the hackamore is simply going to intimidate that horse so that he's always looking to stay behind any sort of contact for fear of getting his face bumped. he's not going to look to meet your hand or find that neutral zone wherever it may be at the time. You have to be careful with a super low headed horse also, because they can end up heavier on their front end than one that has his head up high.
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Old 05-18-2013, 06:18 PM   #9
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Smile

Thank you all ! i have it clearer now how not do it ,as im looking for the way you say .. don't want it low..just to get him more round neck .. i think i could call it like that.. i think too that its something that comes after a while riding ,,when he is more up warmed..little by little ... i will keep going , does anyone know a good DVD that explains more.. or show some more ???,as over here i don't have anyone that i can learn from so it has to be by picking up information and trying .. while im saving for a clinic out side the country!
i have to learn .. he is so much happier after i strated whit the bosal and i am too ! ;-)

Muchas Gracias !
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:47 AM   #10
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Thank you Zian ! I will get them , and absorb every single second and details of the DVD´s Gracias
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